BAGELS & BALONEY
A Retiree’s “Ready Room” is the best way to describe the “Bagels and Baloney (BAB)” aviator enthusiast meet up group. Aviators and veterans gather around to relax, reminisce and enjoy a mean cup of coffee, preferably jet black.
It’s the Comradery that is valued most amongst these aviator enthusiasts. Their ages and experiences span from WWII through the current Global War on Terror. Most are experienced aviators that have served and retired military or moved on to flying commercial airlines. They all have a story to tell. As I scanned the room, I tried to keep track of all the different branches of service they proudly displayed on their baseball caps. They didn’t boast and they didn’t brag, unless provoked by a fellow aviator, then hanger banter broke loose until one of the opponents surrendered from laughter. No, instead, these aerial giants preferred to sit and listen, nodding in agreement with the conversation at hand or offering an opinion and some insight.
A gentleman by the name of Bill Kent sat comfortably on a sofa, wearing a Korean War Veteran cap. He granted me a smile and I snapped a picture, unknowing that he once flew the celebrated F4U Corsair off carriers, which is not an easy task to do. The engine of the F4U was positioned in such a way that the pilots could not see beyond the nose very well. Due to the poor visibility, they were forced to land on a curved approach, relying mainly on the directions of their Landing Signal Officer (LSO).
The oldest aviator present was 98 year-old, Colonel Vince LaBerge, USAF, Retired. He’s flown over 43 different types of planes and served in three wars, WWII, Korea and Vietnam. It was difficult not take a knee before him, in gratitude, respect and honor.
Not all who gathered were aviators, Michael McManus is a Marine Corps veteran. He served with the ground troops during the Vietnam War, which was notable by the missing flesh on the right side of his neck caused by Agent Orange exposure. It took years, but eventually the exposure developed into cancer as we are finding that commonality amongst our Vietnam veterans today. McManus attends the BAB Group to help with his PTSD. “It’s good therapy for me. When you suffer from PTSD, you want to be in the presence of those who understand you,” Mc Manus explains.
The group initially started with four men enjoying their Friday morning cup of coffee at a local Starbucks. They would tell stories of their day of reign, and as customers came in with distinctive veteran caps, another conversation would begin. The group expanded and eventually became so large it moved to a spot outside of “Sidny’s Deli,” off Bernardo Plaza Drive. The owner would keep a “2 Buck Bowl” out and if you wanted a cup of coffee or a bagel, you’d throw two bucks into the bowl. One of the group members suggested, “If we’re going to keep meeting like this, don’t you think we ought to have a name?” They agreed upon “Bagels & Baloney.” It was decided that Sidny’s Deli would provide the bagels and the pilots would provide all the baloney.
The moderator of the BAB group is forty year jet flying veteran, Hank Goetz. Hank was a jet fighter with the Air Force and then retired as a 747 Captain with TWA after 34 years. He has more than 21,000 hours of flying and he has visited over 85 countries during his career. When asked, “What inspired you to fly?” Hank quickly responded, “The love of freedom, there’s nothing like it. When you’re up there, you are in total control of your life. I remember being 7 years old and looking straight up into the sky as an airplane flew by, saying to myself, that’s what I want to do… It’s an incredible experience and the best part is someone else was paying me to have all that fun.”
What I found most appealing about the group was the discussion format. Captain Hank would ask one of the members to give a debriefing on a recent aviation event, then he would open up the group to questions, encouraging feedback and stories that members would like to share. Everyone was very at ease with each other, you felt a great sense of admiration and respect for one another. When someone spoke, they all listened. It’s hard not to. There wasn’t one story told without distinctive flying hand gestures waving about, depicting an airplane. Their overly excited facial expressions seemed as if they had just stepped off their plane moments before. The others would follow with a comment or a playful tease as aviators often do to rile each other up.
Hank would bring up interesting aviation topics, such as the “Pilot Shortage, Back with a Vengeance” article featured in Air Force Magazine or the more humorous article, “Under the Big Jets,” by, Christine Negroni, where Saint Martin beachgoers tempt fate near a runway despite the “Do Not Stand. DANGER. Jet Blast” signs on the runway chain linked fence. The tourists risk their lives for a thrill and try to get as close as possible to an incoming commercial airplane to only find themselves blown away by the force of the jet exhaust. The BAB group laughed whole-heartedly at the stupidity of the vacationers. The topics were interesting and fun, which made it easy for members to engage in conversation. The group then closed the meeting with mostly clean jokes and Hank welcomed any last comments they wished to express.
At this particular meeting, it was CAPT E. Royce Williams, USN, Retired that was asked to debrief the 2016 Tailhook Convention and Symposium. CAPT Williams and I recently attended Tailhook in Reno, Nevada. Williams attends annually for aviation updates and to visit with old friends, whereas I had a very important mission to accomplish. I was gathering signatures to request a re-review for recognition on CAPT Williams behalf. During the Korean War, Williams single-handedly engaged 7 Russian MiGs and shot down four of them.
His amazing feat was kept “Top Secret” for over fifty years. He has yet to be recognized for his act of valor, protecting Naval Task Force 77 and at that time conceivably preventing us from WWIII. Russia claimed neutrality, but in truth they were supporting North Korea. America did not want that information disclosed publicly to avoid the possibility of war.
I was asked to visit the BAB group back in January, 2016 when I had first taken an interest in writing an article on behalf of CAPT Williams, “The Forgotten Hero of The Forgotten War.” 91 year old, Williams has been a long time member of the Bagels and Baloney Group.
Williams joined the service when he was only 16 years old and has served our country for over 35 years. He has flown over 220 missions, mainly in Korea and Vietnam, but one aerial engagement during the Korean War stood above them all.
On November 18th, 1952, CAPT E. Royce Williams, USN Retired, then Lieutenant (Lt.), during the height of the “Korean conflict,” single-handedly engaged in a fierce 35 minute aerial combat that no other American aviator has accomplished either in the Korean War, Vietnam War or since then. Up against freezing temperatures, 400’ ceiling, snow clouds and 40 knot winds, Williams fought 7 MiG-15s while protecting Naval Task Force 77.
His superb piloting skills and gunnery accounted for three known MiG-15s downed and a fourth (the flight leader) confirmed some years later by the Russian government. Lt. Williams fired all of his ammo and suffered a 37 mm hit in his right wing stub by a closely pursuing Mig-15, which caused total loss of rudder and flaps, forcing Williams to dive for cloud cover. He was left with only elevator control and a little aileron control. Lt. Williams skillfully jinked and porpoised until he was safely in the snow clouds. Williams was preparing for a straight in approach towards the USS Oriskany, when he momentarily was forced to avoid friendly fire.
Williams dropped his tailhook and gravity dropped his landing gear. The damage made the aircraft uncontrollable below 170 knots, critically above the normal 105 knots, with 40 knots of wind across the deck. Still, Lt. Williams demonstrated masterful airmanship in landing safely aboard, barely catching the #3 wire. Examination of his F9F-5 Panther aircraft revealed 263 bullet holes. The damage was so severe they could not repair the plane and it had to be pushed overboard. He fought entirely over water, halfway between the USS Oriskany and Vladivostok. Lt. Williams’ courage above and beyond the call of duty against overwhelming odds, stopped the MiG-15s’ attack in its tracks.
During a private one on one meeting with Vice Admiral (VADM) Briscoe, Commander Naval Forces, FarEast, Briscoe disclosed that there was a “secret” intelligence agency in place, called the National Security Agency (NSA) and that they were on their first mission when the Nov. 18th event took place. The NSA confirmed 3 MiG-15 kills on the “real time” voice intercepts that day. VADM Briscoe ordered Lt. Williams “not to tell anyone” about the engagement. Williams didn’t… Not his squadron Commanding Officer (CO), not his Commander Air Group (CAG), not the CO of the USS Oriskany, not Carrier Task Force 77 (CTF-77), not even his wife.
Shortly after the confirmation, at President elect Eisenhower’s personal request, Lt. Williams was honored and toasted in a meeting in Seoul, Korea mid-December, 1952. Also present were Secretary of Defense Wilson, General (Gen) Mark Clark, Gen Omar Bradley, Gen Ridgeway, Admiral (ADM) Radford, Vice Admiral (VADM) Jocko Clark (CTF-77), and Eisenhower’s son, John Eisenhower. Due to political concerns in Washington regarding the newly established secret intelligence (NSA), the recording of the aerial engagement could not be revealed. At that time, Russia insisted they were neutral during the Korean conflict and the MiG-15s were obviously flown by Russian pilots. These two major factors invoked a “Top Secret” lid on the event to avoid the “conflict” to escalate into another World War. Although, Williams was awarded the Silver Star for one confirmed kill, the crucial NSA information was not available to the USS Oriskany nor the drafters of the Silver Star awarded.
His extraordinary feat was kept “Top Secret” for over fifty years. The challenge has been obtaining accurate records, which has proven to be an incredibly difficult task, since a “phony” report was submitted to appease Washington’s request on the day of the event. Although Russia has confirmed the names of the four downed pilots, the death certificates of the Russian pilots have not yet been obtained.
WE NEED YOUR HELP to honor our “Forgotten Hero,” CAPT Williams. Please sign & share the petition to request a re-review for recognition: www.HomelandMagazine.com
Our hope is to honor Williams with the Medal of Honor before he is off to his final mission.
CAPT Williams is just one example of our American history that is found at the Bagels & Baloney Meet Up Group. Another beloved member and fellow aviator, who recently passed this last year at the age of 96, was legendary, Steve Pisanos, “The Flying Greek.”
At a very young age, Pisanos wanted to fly, but, being from a poor family, he knew the only way he could accomplish his dreams was to immigrate to the United States. Unable to speak English and with only $8 dollars to his name, he fled to America. With great persistence, Pisanos became a famed WWII Flying Ace. “The Flying Greek” movie trailer, was recently featured in the San Diego GI Film Festival. Fellow aviators and BAB members, Director Mark “Viz” Vizcarra, and Producer Vic Vizcarra, knew Pisanos well and were compelled to tell their friends inspiring story. The film is seeking funding and if you are interested in supporting this amazing project, please contact Director Mark Vizcarra: [email protected], (858)487-5818.
Bagels & Baloney preserves our American history through conversation and camaraderie. Their concern and great respect for each other restores what seems to be lost in the world…Brotherly love.
God Bless BAB and all their members!
-CJ Machado, veteran advocate and photojournalist
